18: Omayya Atout, Founder of Songlorious.com, a SharkTank featured company that hit $5 million in revenue after only 2.5 yrs. Their musicians make custom songs for any occasion that tell your story.

paris_vega: Welcome to the first customers podcast Today we have O Mia, a tout founder in co of song, Glorious, song, Glorious, as a company that was featured on Shark Tank, and they have a roster of musicians that make custom songs for you for any occasion to help you tell your story, and in just two and a half years, they've already hit five million in revenue, so he's got a lot of things we could learn from him from his story and how they got started. Mia. welcome to the omayya_atout: Hey, Paris, thanks for having me. paris_vega: Now I said O Maya, But I'm just thinking about what we talked about before it's O mea, isn't it? omayya_atout: Oh yeah, but I mean, paris_vega: Oh mea omayya_atout: I mean paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: if anybody gets her right at this point, I'm shocked, even my paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: my own mom. I make that joke all the time because she doesn't fully say it correct. paris_vega: Right, o ma a tout right, not eight out omayya_atout: Yeah, that's paris_vega: a omayya_atout: right. paris_vega: tout. omayya_atout: Unless you're in Alabama, then it's out. paris_vega: Yeah, okay mea, where's that name from? What's your ethnic background or where you from? omayya_atout: Yeah, so my dad is actually a Palestinian. so my paris_vega: Wow, omayya_atout: mom is American, so I'm like paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: a mute of some kind. and yeah, and I'm named after his grandpa after his dead, and it's a very rare name even in the Middle East, so paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: they made fun of me over there too, so it doesn't matter. paris_vega: Now, were you born here in America or? omayya_atout: Well, Yeah, it's like a long. It's kind of a long story, But I was born in. I was born in Tuscalusa, Alabama, paris_vega: Oh? Wow, omayya_atout: D, C. hospital, And then paris_vega: Crazy. omayya_atout: when I was five my dad got. He's an engineer and he got a job in the Middle East, so we moved there and then when I was eighteen I graduated high school. Over there, I went to an American school and then came here to go to college and never moved back since. paris_vega: Okay, So that's not what you expect to hear from somebody? kind of a Palestinian name. that I don't know how big the Palestinian community is in Tuscaloosa, That and just for everybody, that's That's where I'm recording from Is Tuscalusa, And so, Um, omayya_atout: Yeah, we got paris_vega: that's omayya_atout: a connection paris_vega: kind of how we omayya_atout: there. paris_vega: got connected. Though linked in. Yeah, omayya_atout: Yeah, so if you ever eaten at hooligans, let's on by palistinians. paris_vega: Oh, no way. I wasn't omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: sure what their ethmistyor nationality was. omayya_atout: yeah, yeah, paris_vega: The hooligans, guys. Okay, popular local restaurant for all those outside of this area omayya_atout: You good food after drinking for a lot of people, paris_vega: For omayya_atout: Alabama. paris_vega: sure. So man, your story, uh, is pretty incredible. I haven't talked to anybody from who's been on the show Shark Tank yet, so let's jump right into. How did you get your very first customers for Song, Glorious? omayya_atout: Yeah, so I mean it's not. It's not like amazing story. There's no like magic that we did. We didn't have kind spell That I was just go back just a little bit. My cousin works on commerce stores and has some commerce stores, And he was just telling me about it and how he does stuff with commerce. And you know I didn't want to. We didn't really want to go the route of commerce just because you know it wasn't something real passionate about and I was thinking you know what are we passionate? Abou We talked about music. we play music, Me and my wife. We lived in Brooklyn at the time and so one day I was sitting on the couch literally just came up with this idea. I was thinking like Hey, we'll make funny songs for people to give to their friends like some kind of joke, songs and stuff, And we record music all the time from home like you know. It sounds like something straight out of the studio. So like it doesn't take long. You know we can make a website, so I make the website quickly on just on shop, And you know shopifiis built for products not service. It's really. You know, I don't know how it is now, but that's how it was when when we started Summer of twenty twenty and we just started. I started the website very simplistic. Didn't look great. Um, and my wife was like, You know, she did feel like starting company And I told her what about the name song Glorious, and she was like All right, I'm an after that just because it was such a great name. So that's how I talked her into it. And then so we put the website up. and because I talked to my cousin with commerce, I set up Facebookads. I just set up a first. My first ad was just a picture. something like Get your customer song, and we advertised. You know, we tried to advertise all over the world and we got our first customer from Australia and it just came like within the first, like five hours selling the website up paris_vega: Did you say you were? You did any advertising to put it out? How did you get the word out about it? omayya_atout: Facebook advertising. paris_vega: Facebook advertising. Okay, omayya_atout: Yeah, so so it was just I set up a Facebook advertising account with very minimal knowledge on it. put up and put some money behind it, and with hen, you know, five hours we got our first paris_vega: Wow, omayya_atout: purchase and it was at a very bad lie, so like I d like. Maybe I had, because I was working on the railroad at the time and I was using all my money that I saved up for this stuff, Nd I put like five hundred dollars behind it, just like Just going to blast it and see what happens, And we only got one customer and you know we didn't make our money back on that, so I just paris_vega: What was omayya_atout: wanted paris_vega: the price omayya_atout: to get. paris_vega: point for the service? How much did the service cost when it first launched? omayya_atout: Yeah, when I first launched it was like we were like we'll do this for anything. Really, So we were setting a like ninety dollars for a full song And that's us paris_vega: No, omayya_atout: writing the song, mixing it, mastering it, recording it, Um, singing it everything. So it takes a lot of work and you got to really kind of be a fairly experienced Um. producer and know how to use daws, when daw is just like a home. M. It's basically the program you used to record music. One's called a d. W. paris_vega: How many hours do you think goes into recording one song? omayya_atout: Yeah, so it varies for so that when we started then I was already pretty good at it. Just you know, very efficient and it would take me about you know, if we were sitting down solidly and my wife together writing the song doing all that, it would take total, probably an hour and a half back then, maybe two hours. Just because we're kind of very experience, we've been recording a lot of music, and at the time right before the pandemic, we were, You know, we were doing like Gigs in Brooklyn and stuff like that. but for our artists and we have like, we have about three hundred artists now on our website and it depends on the artist. It can take somewhere anywhere between thirty minutes to four hours to record a song from start to finish. It just depends on how experience they are and you know, even for one with the you know people who can do in like thirty minutes to an hour, there's till standards they have to meet, so they can just turn in. You know garb That they did in thirty minutes. It still has to meet standards. But if you can meet standards in thirty minutes, then you know that's great because basically you're making more money per hour. paris_vega: Yeah, so did you spend a lot of time Like on the design of the initial website? Did you have experience there or did you just use like a random Shopify theme and throw it up there? omayya_atout: Yeah, I mean, literally just threw it up there. No design experience. In fact, I'm very bad at bein. My wife is much better at design, so she tells me, but I believe her. I think she is, And yeah, like, I just threw it up there. And for the logo I got some. Somebody hired somebody on line to just create a logo for us. That kind of saw like we gave him a little detail in what we're looking for, and he gave us a logo. paris_vega: How much did you spend on the logo? You think? omayya_atout: I don't remember. It wasn't a lot. It was less than a hundred dollars. paris_vega: Wow, omayya_atout: Yeah, but it came out solid and exactly what we were picturing in our heads, so stuck with it paris_vega: Yeah, Was that still the logo today? The same omayya_atout: Still paris_vega: one. pretty much. omayya_atout: still until this day. paris_vega: okay, Um, the first customer came through the Facebook adds for five hundred dollars. And then how do you get the next customer omayya_atout: From then on it was a long series of figuring out how to run digitous media adds, and how to reach. also how to reach customers as organically as possible, Because we could quickly realize so much of our cost end up going towards advertising. You know, digital advertising can be expensive, but paris_vega: For sure? omayya_atout: you can make you. can. you can make a lot of revenue. I mean, you know, if you want to make profitable revenue, you got to really get Our ad cost down. And that's that's the hardest part and that's really paris_vega: Eh, omayya_atout: where it comes down to. You know, I've always said that I find the marketing part. I don't find the marketing heart because I know what I want to market. I know what you know. what our product is. I know what's good about us and all that. it's the. It's the skill of digital advertising and add. buying. That's the hard part and that's when you need paris_vega: M omayya_atout: experts that know how to really run, adds and test adds, and all that kind of you know paris_vega: For sure, omayya_atout: anything that has to do with digital advert And that's the real skill in my opinion. paris_vega: Definitely omayya_atout: Yeah, so so so yeah, I mean, I guess to answer your question, we just started getting tried to get better at running as ourselves before we ended up trying hire out the marketing, and eventually we got. we started making enough money to where we could both quit our jobs. I was, I'm a civil engineer, you know, graduate from Alabama, like you, and I was working on a track. at the time. I was on this Pen station project and we were rebuilding At Jrackonpen station, But anyway it's born. That's why I left, but we got to the to a point where we were like I could quit my job today and I remember I told. I told my wife Ellen, who, as a co founder, by the way, I told her and she was with me on short time, but I told her if today if we make eight hundred dollars, this was like a month and I was like if we make eight hundred dollars by like noon today revenue, I'm going to quit my job in, And that day we made like twelve hundred, and I called. I called in and gave my two weeks put in my two weeks notice, and it was like the most nerve racking time of my life because I'd never quit a job before. Well, that's not true. I quite job before, but not without having another job wind up paris_vega: Right. So why did you make that ultimatum for yourself at that day? that was. omayya_atout: Because it was a risky moving. Honestly, it was just you know, for anybody working a job, I've been working on the railroad for ten years in railroads. It's very hard work and I loved railroading. you know Is enjoyable or but paris_vega: I think they need your help these days, Man, we've had some issues here lately with the railroads. omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: All these omayya_atout: yeah, paris_vega: crashes. That's crazy. omayya_atout: yeah, I got something to tell you about that though, If paris_vega: Okay. Okay, omayya_atout: we'll get to it, but paris_vega: For sure. omayya_atout: yeah, so I just decided you know, like if I, if I want to do this properly, I got to be full time, paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: but I don't want to do it full time. I don't want to do a full time unless it can be justified. You know, I don't want to make a crazy decision and quit my job and then not have anything, and then we go under. So I said a number, and honestly, it was still a little too early because I feel like that Could have still went wrong and I would have been totally screwed. you know what I mean, but it worked out so I'm glad I quit my job that day. paris_vega: So how did you get the money to go from losing four hundred and ten dollars on that first sale? Like, And that was all your ad budget at the time. Did you just have to save up until you had more money and then run another add before you got another customer to start off? Like. how did you scale your ad spend if you were just personally funding it? omayya_atout: Yeah, I mean, I basically like I had credit cards, just like you know, just like paris_vega: Really omayya_atout: anybody else had credit cards, and I was just starting to put Facebook adds on my credit cards and I was rocking up credit card that when we started out, Yeah, it was. It was a horrible paris_vega: Yah, omayya_atout: move. That's why when people asked for advice, I'm like you know, don't ask me. Maybe I might paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: not be the best person. I just I might have been lucky. but uh paris_vega: For sure, Yeah, you went all in. omayya_atout: yes, yeah, I went all in and I mean, we really really believed in the idea And we started seeing a lot of customers early on, and we became profitable very quickly, although you know wasn't a crazy amount of profit, but it was enough to start like being able to survive and paid that off quickly. So you know our cost was very low at the time. Other than you know paying the artists. paris_vega: So at first you were doing all those songs yourself. How long before you know? you're just swiping the credit card to get people to request songs And you're just kind of floating that that money until you're You're making enough. two questions. When did you have? were you able to stop using the credit card to float your ad spend, And then also, when were you able to start outsourcing some of the song making omayya_atout: Yeah, like so honestly within maybe like three. like Within a month, we started getting artists contacting us because they saw ad and saying like, Hey, I'm an artist. Are you looking for people to join the team And we'd be like Yeah, Because we started to get to a point where our Facebook guys were so successful that we were getting too many orders that you know too, any orders and couldn't handle the orders paris_vega: Now? Are you still omayya_atout: right. paris_vega: that first? After the first month they were that successful. the Facebook adds, omayya_atout: Yeah, probably after a month two. It. it was very quick. paris_vega: So okay, let's pause for a second, Because ve got a lot of experience in Facebook Add, so I'm curious how did you iterate your add, creative or whatever, to figure out what worked better than five hundred dollars per sale omayya_atout: Yeah, it's we did a horrible job out. I'm telling you, like, if I had any advice to give anyone that wants to do digital advertising, really, really, try to figure out how to do it properly Because I wasted a lot of money early on trying to just messing around with it so early and look, Facebooks changed a lot, so I'm sure you know a few paris_vega: Has. omayya_atout: used Facebook adds. It used to be. It seemed like it was throw money at Facebook Adds, and just customers would be rushing Towards you. Like, like they show the exact person you want that you want to see our ad. So at the time we had like three add sets. not at sets, but three add creative, just like pictures of like a couple, and with one of the customer songs playing over it and just you know the copy would be. You know something about you know. Get a customer song for your love to one. Something like that, and That worked for us well, especially when we're doing the songs ourselves. We could afford to spend a lot on ads, even though customer acquisition cost was high, would still be able to make some money on the back. and because we were just, we didn't have to pay anybody. we were doing the songs ourselves. you know, so we're kind of just creating songs for money. paris_vega: And what was that very first add? Was it that similar format like a couple in a song in the background? omayya_atout: Yeah, the first and was just a guy playing guitar. It was a picture. I still remember the picture and it was just like Get a customer song. Something like that. paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: It was just a picture and we use those and actually those were very successful back in the days Back in the in the day, it seems like once the is changes happened, and for anyone who doesn't know that you know is change their policy for as they basically can't track users across Apse anymore. Um, Once they did that change, uh, it became, you have to really really focus in on Um, honing in your ads and perfecting them and testing them for them to be profitable at all, and have any decent kind of Um, as opposed to before, you could really just go anything out there and it wouldn't be amazing, but you be able to make money if you have a big product. paris_vega: Yeah, and so the like What was at twenty twenty one? The privacy issues hit Facebook really hard And then omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: that probably hit you guys just like it hit everybody else. omayya_atout: Oh yeah, I mean immediate. like as soon as it came in like Within six months we started we could. It felt it was really bad because we had to, but we had to make an adjustment. It's just something you know you got to do with the business anyway. You've got to always be ready to make adjustments. But yeah, it really hurt better. and when people I understand people's like concern. for you know, privacy on Facebook and stuff like that, and I try not to be biased and of course I am because you know I have a business that depends On Facebook adds. I mean, among other ones, but a lot to Facebook adds, And I just sometimes I just want to tell people like you know. I'm not a hundred percent of this opinion because I don't know what Facebooks doing exactly, but I know that mainly they're tracking people to sell them adds. and paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: if they want to get adds that are relevant to them, then Facebook is going to have to track. Otherwise you're going to get some random adds here and there. That doesn't mean anything to you. You know Nother than that, but it also, Facebook is huge for small businesses, because any small paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: business can launch and then become very popular through Facebook adds. But when the cost of D is going up, you know it's hard to get your feet off the ground and we kind of got lucky starting before this happened. paris_vega: Yeah, I think so I started. I think I ran my first Facebook adding like two thousand eight, and for omayya_atout: Oh paris_vega: like omayya_atout: wow, paris_vega: I was doing, I was doing like freelance graphic design at the time and I got I spent fifty dollars and got uh like five hundred dollar logo design job from it and a omayya_atout: Wow, paris_vega: one thou one thousand dollar website job from omayya_atout: Wow, paris_vega: it back then and but I wasn't in the marketing mind set back then at all, and I was just like awesome, but I can Afford to keep spending this crazy fifty dollars for adds. an. So I never add gain omayya_atout: Oh, paris_vega: back then omayya_atout: wow, paris_vega: until later in my career when I was doing marketing and stuff, and closer to like, twenty thirteen or fourteen started running Adds for a client I was working with and it was still kind of the golden age of Facebook. Adds. it wasn't as good as it was in the early early days where you could upload like one email address to ten email addresses and target that small of a list of people. Um, but you know now you got to have at least a thousand or a hundred or whatever it is now, and there's all the privacy issues, so a lot of the targeting options went away. But but yeah, it's crazy how much it's changed over the years and omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: I think somebody's starting out definitely has a different. Just. it's like a higher entry level or learning omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: curve or whatever, starting a new business now? omayya_atout: Yeah, a big time learning curve and costs wise. it's hard. paris_vega: Right? omayya_atout: it's hard to like people. I've helped people start like they want to start a business like I try to help them with the Facebookads. It's just like it's expensive to get started now. paris_vega: Yeah, so you focused on trying out different creative, different types of ads until you found something that was a better cost per sale cost for conversion. omayya_atout: H. exactly? paris_vega: Um, and that took about a month before. Well, you said. Within a month or two, the ad started generating a lot of lead, so I guess omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: even less than sounded like a couple of weeks. You guys iterated must have iterated through several different omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: types omayya_atout: I mean, paris_vega: of creative. omayya_atout: but here's the thing. We weren't iterating that much back than we were. Just I was just launching and trying different targeting. I wasn't like paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: changing. I wasn't changing the creative as much, which is why it wasn't like the best return on Aspen. paris_vega: So it's partly maybe the Facebook picks or whatever, Learning who's omayya_atout: Yeah, just paris_vega: who's buying And then you're also testing targeting. And so it's getting omayya_atout: Exactly, and paris_vega: okay. omayya_atout: the Facebook Pico. Mostly, you know that that thing is powerful and it knows it really knows who your customers are. Sometimes I feel like it doesn't give us, you know. Back in the day it wouldn't give us customers. I'd be like the pickle doesn't like us today or something. You know. It's like paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: it's against us, but yeah, mostly just epical learning, and I mean the most inefficient way, like I want to say, most efficient way to start a business, But really it was efficient Is just when it comes to marketing, we didn't The money to hire marketing experts early on, so I was just learning as I was going, and trying to spend as little as possible while while making money without, you know, without throwing too much money at it. And you know, if you put too much money on Facebook and they'll just spend it and you'll get no customers. So paris_vega: All right, So you figured out something that worked on Facebook and then twenty twenty one hits. Everything gets harder on Facebook. Did you pivot to other platforms Because I think that's right around when Tik Tok was starting to spike and omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: everybody started looking omayya_atout: yeah, paris_vega: elsewhere to see it? Yeah, omayya_atout: Yeah, I started. We started looking for. so we were. We were barely. We had really good. so from the beginning very early on, and that's because I hired just once again. You got. Remember like I didn't know anything, and I still mostly don't know anything. But at the time I was just like You know you, Google. Like how do you improve Co, and the people come up there like we can fix your Co. I find a decent person that's like you know, Like not a company but a guy Who does so help because he had. he had lower costs than he seemed like he knew while he was talking about, and I just told him he got the website song Glorious, And I want you elped with Co and Co is something really hard to learn for like people is just starting businesses and it's like paris_vega: Sure, omayya_atout: it's complex to understand. I'm just trying to put myself in the mind set Back then how long it took me to understand what Co is? And and it's all it is. Isoptimizing Google. Basically it's not. It's mainly Google because nobody's using. I mean, there's people using other ones, but Google paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: is the main paris_vega: yeah, omayya_atout: one and it's paris_vega: for sure, omayya_atout: just trying paris_vega: yeah, omayya_atout: to show up at the top when people search key words that are similar yours. paris_vega: Right, omayya_atout: That's how I understand it. And anyway, this guy helped you know launch some. I don't know key words and certain blogs and stuff like that to get us better Co. so Co started getting better pretty quickly, but we now Advertise on Google. So once the you know it's early, it's January, you know, early twenty twenty One. I'm thinking my mind set, which is when I searched for something on Google. I automatically scrolled past the Adds to the top thing and I thought everybody did that, but I was paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: very wrong and not everybody does that. So once I realized that and we launched Google ahead again, very bad at launching Google as everything is not running well. still early in the company And it's it's expensive. and and our return on Aspen is so bad. Um, but that's when we started doing more Google ads, which right now is like one of our best sources of customers. paris_vega: Add. it's not just the So the organic omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: trap omayya_atout: both, I mean, Google adds is very good. The organic is good, and I mean yeaharegoogle, as good as Facebookta, bring us customers. paris_vega: Now, is it? Both of them like Facebook got harder, So it came up to kind of what Google's level was. Or did Google get down? You know what I mean, Like, Did Facebook just get harder and more expensive to where it rose up to what Googles level? Was you think? or was it Google improving as well? omayya_atout: I just think well at this point, I mean it's It's a really long running story paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: up to you know where we are now, but it's all about. That's why I say the ad buyers so important. The person who's paris_vega: M. omayya_atout: at buying because they have a set of skills That are. It's like it's like I feel like a four year university degree in ad buying wouldn't be enough to know what some of these people know, paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: because they constantly have to update their knowledge. but I think Just optimizing the ads is kind of equalized. It may actually, our Google adds a little better than Facebook when it comes to return on investment, but now our Facebook is catching up again. paris_vega: And so now you've got people running those both of those things for you. omayya_atout: Yeah, yeah, I got. I've got a guy who's amazing at running. As probably, I've never seen anyone out there better than, paris_vega: Wow, omayya_atout: and he's not like a known guy like you know. There's a lot of famous gouos out there and stuff. paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: awesome. all right. So October twenty twenty one, You got under Shark Tank Season Thirteen, Episode two, You're on there. How that happened? omayya_atout: Yeah, so you know, when you're we're running a business and we're just like trying to come up with. We've always got ideas. you know, Everybody s always putting ideas on and we've been suggested shark tank a bunch of times, and I'm just like I'm not a pessimist, but I'm kind of a pessimist, but I'm kind of like a, trying to be a realist, and like what's possible. And when you see the amount of people that applied to shark tank and that get on, it's like it's like Most impossible to get on, so I always dismissed it and then one day we're just like Let's let's let's just apply and see what happened. So we applied for a short tank. We got a call back was like, Oh, okay, that's crazy. There's like ten steps before you even get approved for the that you're going to be on the show. So there's like ten paris_vega: Really? omayya_atout: separate steps that are separated by like months. you know, So we probably applied in January of twenty twenty one, and then we were on the show Or maybe like, Yeah, Yeah, probably around January to March of twenty twenty one, And we were on the show by July, twenty twenty one. So there's months of separation. paris_vega: And then the show aired in October omayya_atout: You're goin an October. Yeah, paris_vega: Yet. omayya_atout: yeah, so paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: we just apply it and every step we kept getting pushed through. Um, and you know they assign you to some junior producers and they kind of walk you through everything and they, you know, one day submit a video, then you submit a pitch and then pitch to the producers and and then it just gets more and more in depth until they're like you're going to be on the show and then they tell you just so you know. Even even if you record the episode, you still might not there, so don't like get your hopes up. So They said you know you're not guaranteed to be on the show until you see your face on the T. V. That's said very last second. So you're like. paris_vega: So they're omayya_atout: So paris_vega: okay? omayya_atout: the whole time I'm like this is never going to happen. Never, and then it paris_vega: Did omayya_atout: happens. paris_vega: they give you? So do they give you any hint? Like once it's going to be on the show? Do they tell you like what the possible date is or episode or something like that? omayya_atout: Yeah, so they tell you two weeks ahead of time. paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: They tell you your episode is going to grant two weeks, but they tell you that that's still not a guarantee, paris_vega: Got omayya_atout: you know, paris_vega: you omayya_atout: but they give you two weeks two weeks notice, and the only reason they do this courtesy just so you can prepare your website and stuff for this surge of customers. paris_vega: Okay. And omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: so it was purely just you guys was thinking. Hey, we could get a little marketing. you know, get the name out there, and I guess best case scenario would be get one of the sharks to invest and help scale it even more. Um, omayya_atout: Yeah, exactly yeah. paris_vega: can omayya_atout: so paris_vega: you talk about that experience of actually doing the show omayya_atout: Yeah. So so we had our pitch ready and we practiced it, you know, a million times at least, and even in the hotel room, you know, they flows out to L. and in the hotel room all night we slept like three hours. Maybe obviously could not sleep at all, And we're just practicing the pitch over and over and over. The pitch was me and my wife together, and you know we finally go to day, and you know in our minds we know we got an amazing company where we're go And fast. You know we're profitable at a very early time, or know the company's lifetime. Um, so we're confident, but we're always. you know. we're skeptical. Like if we, we've got all these. We've practiced all our answers to the hard questions because you know there. Of course there's gonna be hard questions and we're ready for the answers because we've watch Sharp Tank and we've seen people get totally destroyed and we did not want to be the people on T V forever that got destroyed, you know, and have a paris_vega: Over omayya_atout: com paris_vega: and omayya_atout: Lation paris_vega: over? omayya_atout: on Youtube or something. paris_vega: Yeah, I've omayya_atout: So paris_vega: seen those omayya_atout: Yeah, exactly so you would have seen us probably by now if we've done something stupid, but you know, paris_vega: Right omayya_atout: we just very careful about it and we went up and not expecting much. Our expectations weren't high, because we don't like to be disappointed. So and we, you know, spoiler alert for anybody. Should I spoil it right now? Find? I mean, it's old episode. paris_vega: Up to you. omayya_atout: Yeah, so it's all Episode. So paris_vega: Okay. omayya_atout: so Ah, we get up there. We pitch and the the sharks out there with Mark Cuban, Damon, John, M. Peter Jones, who's a British shark from the T V Show Dragons, then back in England, paris_vega: Okay, yeah, I've heard of that girl. omayya_atout: Kevinolery, and then I forgot her name Laurie. paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: So those are the five sharks that were up there and you know We give. We give our spell and stuff, and they ask us just a couple of questions, And then they asked us our numbers, and at the time you know we had. We had generated one point seven million. I think at the time I don't remember. paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: you know, Don't have a good memory of what we were back then, But so they were very impressed by that. And then we get a offer from Peter Jones, and what people don't know is in the background. You can hear all the producers That helped you get on the show. They start cheering in the background Is very distracting actually, But so they're They're on your side. It's really. It's really nice. but paris_vega: That's cool. omayya_atout: yeah, and you know then we're like. Well, we got off like you know. We're like shocked that we got off because we watched so many episodes of people just getting destroyed, So it's like you have that worst scenario in your mind and then you know, then then another sharp damn. John offers to offer, Makes a deal or makes an offer. Sorry that you know, beats out Peter Jones's deal, and then Kevin and Mark. They're whispering in the corner, Really distracting. while I'm trying to talk to one of the sharks, and then they come in and ask to come in together on the deal. Both of them. So we're like our minds are blown at this point. We're just we paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: don't even know to do because you know we're in shock on T. V. It's honestly like a very weird feeling just watching that for paris_vega: Can omayya_atout: so paris_vega: imagine. omayya_atout: long and then being there and then they decide like they want to get all Four of them together. Everybody but lay on a deal for forty per cent for five hundred thousand, which brings down our valuation. We went in with a ten per cent for four hundred thousand, So brings it down from like four million valuation down to like one point two million or something. paris_vega: So what would be? What was your profit at the time? omayya_atout: So our profit time was nine percent. paris_vega: Nine percent. omayya_atout: Uh, yeah, paris_vega: So omayya_atout: and on paris_vega: it's omayya_atout: the show paris_vega: in profit margin. omayya_atout: Yeah, yeah, and even they asked us, they said, Is that before you pay yourselves? he said, That's obviously before you after you pay yourselves, and I was like, No, That's before we pay ourselves. and they're like. Oh, um, you know, but you know we're a young company at that point. Really just paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: been around for a year at that point. paris_vega: Kit. omayya_atout: Yeah, just just a year at that point. So it's a paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: very young company and we're still young so Yeah, we get. we get a deal and we take a deal with four sharks for forty percent for Five hundred thousand. Yeah, and to make a long story short, you know, it's a long process that takes afterwards and we were getting to the point where we actually we actually start like we have a lot of things we need to do to move forward. We've got like we need to re, design or website. We've got a. You know, our orders are increasing and we still have a very pretty primitive website. It's not on Chopofie anymore, So it's like, but it's not good enough at all to handle. the orders are getting. So paris_vega: What do omayya_atout: that paris_vega: you move omayya_atout: takes, paris_vega: to after typify? omayya_atout: we moved to wit. And paris_vega: Really? omayya_atout: the nice thing about wit is it's very programmable. paris_vega: Really? omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: I've never heard that move before from Shop of wick. omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: and because, paris_vega: they must have omayya_atout: because paris_vega: made it omayya_atout: we're paris_vega: more omayya_atout: a service, paris_vega: flexible. Now. Okay, omayya_atout: Yes, it's a lot more. it's a lot more programmable. So we. paris_vega: I think omayya_atout: you paris_vega: so omayya_atout: know. paris_vega: changed a lot on that program ability front lately. but go ahead, sorry. omayya_atout: Yeah, they might have been. Obviously they might be. It might be good. Now. it might be something to look at. but I mean, paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: were a service were kind of like. You know, if you're a service, you have to have pretty good technology to deal with customers, and stuff like that. With Shop of five you have a product is perfect. But if paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: you have, if you have a digital service, it's not not so great. Maybe it's changed, but paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: so anyway, it took very long for them to to get back with us And they're just you know, because they're reviewing stuff and their busiest. It's nothing. You know. nothing. we're resentful over, but we really had to tell them like Hey, either we get this deal like now or we just get no deal at all, and we literally sent an email telling them this and they. basically, they basically just said, All right, you know, You know like we feel like the help you need other than monetary help. We don't feel like we can provide them. And we told them at the time on the show that you know we're looking for business help in general because we're not business people. We're learning as we go right now, you know, but paris_vega: Got omayya_atout: we've paris_vega: you. omayya_atout: already made a company this successful with very little business knowledge. We've we've learned what we've learned as we've created this business, and basically the deal was done at that point, And paris_vega: Wow, omayya_atout: were we were actually at the time after waiting so long we were. We were happy. very happy about that because we wanted to get hit the ground running with stuff we wanted to do. Um, and we ended up. what happened afterwards was to update the website, which is one of the things we told the sharks we wanted to. We wanted the money you know to use to upgrade the website. I basically spent the next like five months learning job of script while creating the website Programme the entire website myself, paris_vega: Really. omayya_atout: while my wife did the design, paris_vega: Whoa. omayya_atout: literally learned job of script from scratch and knew nothing about it and just did it myself. paris_vega: That's crazy. So what made you choose to go down that path instead of hiring a web developer or something like that? An agency omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: here? omayya_atout: so we initially hired a web developer for our wet site, but it just wasn't Can you hear me by the way? paris_vega: Yeah, it just clipped for a second, but I can hear you. omayya_atout: Yeah, okay, yeah, because I think my headphones are dying and I'll just have to switch paris_vega: Oh, omayya_atout: the different microphone. Yeah, we hired one of. actually, but you know it was a very low cost programmer and they didn't do a great job and I just started messing around with it and over time I just started to figure it out the coding for it and just started doing it on my own. And it was it was. It was a very long. I mean, I was working twelve hours a day trying to optimize this and I decided to do this because of saving money creating paris_vega: Yeah. omayya_atout: a customer, So I cost probably something like a hundred. a hundred thousand dollars. I got a couple of quotes before I started doing that, and I was like that's just too much money for us. We have no outside funding. This is still our own money. We're putting all profits back into the company and we got to do this efficiently, so paris_vega: At that time you were both full time into the company. omayya_atout: Yeah, we're both full time to paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: the company. Yea, so we're spending paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: all paris_vega: Well omayya_atout: day paris_vega: that, omayya_atout: on this non stop. paris_vega: so I guess If you ask if you're spending five months full time learning job of script that that makes sense. omayya_atout: Yeah, and and it wasn't learning job job of script. like independently, I was doing it as I was building the website. paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: So it was just like watching a video doing it on the website, watching and doing testing it constantly. And that's why I say if I could go back to school, I'd be a program one hundred. It's such a useful skill. There's nothing paris_vega: Yep, omayya_atout: like it if you're doing civil engineering like I don't do it. and I'm just getting you should paris_vega: Uh, omayya_atout: still do it. But paris_vega: uh, omayya_atout: but programming is so useful. paris_vega: Yeah, for any digital business or just business in general, you can leverage digital media or the Internet. Much better if you have those programming skills for sure, omayya_atout: No big time. big time. paris_vega: get the robots on your side. omayya_atout: Yeah, and I'm still not like. Obviously, I'm not amazing at it, but I know enough to do a lot of stuff. You know, our websites. Completely, customer does a lot of things. paris_vega: Wow, and are you still working on the website yourself or you have you outsourced that part? omayya_atout: No, I still still do it on my own when I, when I need to, but really it kind of runs itself at this point, but you know, paris_vega: Wow, omayya_atout: obviously there's small manant stuff here and there and changes that we do, and I do it and doesn't. not a lot of stuff That takes me long. but obviously with you know, eventually we're going to get. we're going to have some major updates. and and then we'll probably hire that out. paris_vega: Yeah, Incredible story. Uh, And so once you en to the deal with the sharks, That was How long after? was it? you said About six months? Was it after omayya_atout: Yes, paris_vega: being on the show that omayya_atout: six paris_vega: that deal omayya_atout: months paris_vega: was omayya_atout: run paris_vega: opened? omayya_atout: around December. paris_vega: Okay And then how much did it grow Or how fast did it grow From that point on omayya_atout: Yeah, a paris_vega: to omayya_atout: lot of paris_vega: show omayya_atout: people paris_vega: them omayya_atout: ask paris_vega: what I out on? Okay, omayya_atout: like, like what happens after Shark Tent airs and when Sharktcairs, Obviously, it's just like the most traffic we've ever had on the website. It initially after, and every time it rears you get a huge boost, like about half of the peak. paris_vega: Wow, omayya_atout: Every every time it airs, so there is like So far it's aired like every two or three months, so every time it airs it's like a huge like boost for us. It's really great. paris_vega: It's omayya_atout: Um, paris_vega: amazing. omayya_atout: yeah, paris_vega: I never omayya_atout: zero. paris_vega: thought about that with being on a show like that, A series that is an indication. Yeah, you'll get the residual bump every time it airs. omayya_atout: Yeah, it's pretty. It's pretty great. It's paris_vega: Wow, omayya_atout: pretty great and it costs us nothing every time. So it's it's really great. paris_vega: So is it free to be on the show or do they pay to be on the show Or can you give any of that kind of inside? What's that part omayya_atout: Yeah, I mean it's free. It's free to be on the show and you don't pay and they don't pay you. I mean paris_vega: Right? Because they omayya_atout: they paris_vega: know omayya_atout: give you. paris_vega: the marketing boost You're getting omayya_atout: Yeah, Yeah, it's a benefit for for both. Yeah, but I mean all they pay for is a ticket to fly there and they give you a stipend for the day. That's paris_vega: Okay. omayya_atout: yeah, hat's that's all it is. but it's a huge goose for us, so we're very grateful for Shark Tank, And paris_vega: Wow, omayya_atout: and we love the show. I don't know if you watch it often. paris_vega: Oh yeah, yeah, omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: that's omayya_atout: it's a great show. paris_vega: one of my favorite For sure. Um, okay, So you got the shark tank boost, giving you the every couple of months Spike. What are some of the other channels that you're seeing? You said Google. Facebook. Are there any other things you're using to get leads and customers? omayya_atout: Yeah, we're starting to tappin to Tiktok for the in the past, you know, six months or so, and this is why, like again, with the ad bying so important, To hire someone who knows how to add by really well if you want to get adds at A at a good cost. and once you get once, someone gets to a point to where they can hire that out. I think they should immediately do it. It's just hard to work through. Um, you know you gotta. you got to sift through a lot of advertisers Out there who are just very mediocre and you need someone great to be able to get you a good return on your Aspen. And basically that's what we did about a year ago. We hired someone to run our ads, And you know, so our avenues, or Tiktok, Facebook, Instagram, and Google, and that's our main four right now. Um, we haven't tried podcastadvertising paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: Um. A lot of that can get pretty pricy early on, but something we're probably going to be looking into soon. Um, but you know, we, once we hired that guy to runner ads, uh, are revenue and our, you know, our return on ad spend has increased like three fold. It's paris_vega: Wow, omayya_atout: been. it's been. It's been so much better and it's just it's just growing since. paris_vega: Amazing, I think I've seen adds. I don't know if it's your ads, but I've definitely seen adds for a service that does this. I omayya_atout: Yeah. paris_vega: think omayya_atout: yeah, paris_vega: some kind omayya_atout: yeah, paris_vega: of omayya_atout: I'm sure. paris_vega: long writing or like. Like highly, they look Ike, highly produced commercials. Have you guys done anything like that or is that a competitor? omayya_atout: Yeah. so I mean we've done. We've done some highly produced commercials. But what you're I don't. I'm not sure if you're talking about ours or not. There's there's a lot of people like. So the customer song space is basically new. I mean the way the way it is now. paris_vega: Yeah? omayya_atout: like we said on Shark when we were on Shark Tank, they asked us about this and we told them. You know, customer songs are a very old thing. I mean, they used to do the. I forgot what they were called, but they used to tell the what they called the grams with the songs. Yeah, paris_vega: Oh yeah, like a Yeah, like a song, gram or whatever, Telegrams the omayya_atout: Yeah, yeah, something like that, but paris_vega: Singagram. omayya_atout: I forgot what they're called. Yeah, paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: singagram, something like that, paris_vega: yeah, omayya_atout: and uh, yeah, that stuff was. You know, it's been going on for a long time, so even when we came in the space, there was a couple of other. Most of it was individual musicians just doing themselves, not not offering a lot of musicians, and the price was kind of high. And then there was a couple of businesses that are doing what we're doing now, Except it wasn't custom, but it was like you plug in your An. It's a chorus. like, for example, you get the same course. Every person gets the same course. You just change a name in the verse or something like that, So you choose your song And that's kind of what mainly was there back then, But we do have one main competitor now, and the, they're highly highly highly funded. Supposed to us to have enough funded at all. So they have a lot of money paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: to spend paris_vega: got omayya_atout: on advertising paris_vega: ya, omayya_atout: and stuff, but you know paris_vega: Because omayya_atout: Or paris_vega: you omayya_atout: all, paris_vega: guys are boot strapped. I mean because you didn't get the shark tank investment, so you've totally omayya_atout: Yeah, we're both paris_vega: boot strapped omayya_atout: yeah, paris_vega: it omayya_atout: boche paris_vega: all the way. omayya_atout: boot strap from the beginning, but paris_vega: Wow, omayya_atout: I will say that percentage wise, our reviews are the best in the custom song industry and paris_vega: There you go. omayya_atout: I'm not just saying that it's for a good reason, and my wife and I, you know, we did the first five hundred customer songs for the company, and we've paris_vega: Wow. omayya_atout: also, and we've also done. You know, we did five hundred when we first. you know around when we first started, and then we've done a thousand in total. And so we have a lot of experience with stuff people like and stuff they don't. We've got a lot Feed back from customers, which is such an important thing to take and try to optimize the product and we've just we've approved. You know over thirty thousand songs through our quality control system with the artists, So we have very stringent standards and procedures to creating songs. we've specifically have. We have very detailed handbook for the artists on what guide lines to follow and created is creating a song, although they stick Their creativity and their style, But there's certain things that we make sure that every song has before we send it to the customer. And that's why our review. we have, you know, we have like seven thousand reviews total, including like Google reviews and or our own reviews, And it's like four point nine out of five star rating and a lot of that Because of those standards that we set paris_vega: How many customers have you had over the course of the business so far, omayya_atout: About thirty thousand. paris_vega: Who? thirty thousand customers. omayya_atout: Yeah, paris_vega: And that's over two and a half years. omayya_atout: Yep, paris_vega: Totally bora. That's awesome. man. omayya_atout: Appreciate it. paris_vega: Uh, omayya_atout: Yeah, Yeah, it shocks paris_vega: how omayya_atout: us too paris_vega: big do you think you're headed? Like? what do you do? You have an idea of how the size that you're aiming for or you're just kind of going for the ride. omayya_atout: Well. We definitely you know. That's It's a hard question to answer because M, you know, once again like me personally, I'm a skeptical Cal person and I try to be realistic about. paris_vega: M. omayya_atout: but, but we're looking for. you know this year were our revenue goal This year is ten million, Um. And and within the next five years we want to be a. five years from now, We want to be hitting eighty to a hundred million per year. And and the reason why I think paris_vega: Wow, omayya_atout: we can do this is for a couple of reasons. Um, we've seen it. We've seen you know this customer song industry grow, and we're We're one of the first people in this industry. and and not only that, but just for example, if you so wis like, you know, just to see who's popular in the space where we're number one when you search customer songs on Google Organic, Um, So we're at the forefront and it's growing a lot. Uh, so there's a lot of revenue to be made there. But also this is only done in English. So far, I mean paris_vega: Oh, wow. omayya_atout: where. Yeah, so for example, we advertise in India, English, English speaking, like customers for English songs, But I mean, you know, the Hindi music industry is massive and you know people in India, just love Bally Wood music and it's massive over there and something like this would be really a great fit for Um for India, And we've already were already in the talks with some people that are from over there to get started on our hind version of this. and then you know there's Arabic. There's Spanish, Spanish. We already kind of delved into a little bit, But all all these other areas of expansion there's just you know, there's so many people to reach and our customer bases. Really anybody. paris_vega: Yeah. So what's the price point now? omayya_atout: So right now, for example, a, um, it starts at one eighty, one hundred eighty dollars. So for a for an acoustic song that's two minutes long. professionally mixing, you know, professionally home, mixed and mastered. paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: It's one eighty dollars. paris_vega: and do they have the rights to it? Like if they wanted to put it on I tunes or whatever, Distribute it. omayya_atout: Uh, they can't distribute it. We can distribute it, the artist. the artist keeps the rights. And paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: yeah, so we elan and artists. Are you know? we're not artists, but we're you're music artists. paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: At least we call ourselves that and keeping right to something a lot of artists find. you know that's very important to them. paris_vega: Sure, omayya_atout: I mean, they hold that they hold the rights of the song very sacred. and even just talking to them, you know, they, even, they really really care about it even more than Ellen and I initially cared for ourselves. Our copyright. Um, you know, it's just it's the ownership to the song. And so we decide very earlier on they keep the rights of the song. And but if they, if the customer wants to distribute it to Spotifyand, stuff, we offer that as an ad on so we can put it. We have a Spotify paris_vega: I see. omayya_atout: page and we put it on there so they can play it from anywhere you know, in their car, and stuff like paris_vega: Okay. But so the customers just paying for the song to be created. But if there's any like money from down loads, or you know, the little small percentage that all those platforms pay that goes to the artist. omayya_atout: Uh, Well, because of how many streams we get, we don't even we didn't. we don't even have that set up. And the reason is it gets, paris_vega: Got ya omayya_atout: there's paris_vega: such omayya_atout: never paris_vega: a small. omayya_atout: more than Ye such a small part. And I mean, Spotify pays paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: almost nothing. paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: So paris_vega: it's omayya_atout: we. paris_vega: point omayya_atout: we paris_vega: zero, omayya_atout: basically paris_vega: zero zero something. omayya_atout: yes, like zero, zero, zero, three, eight. Something like that. It's paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: It's ridiculously low and we have basically their pay out built in in the in the pay that we give the artist First place, so so they'll make more money just from that payment than they'll ever paris_vega: Right, omayya_atout: make on Spotifyed, because they'll never be paris_vega: yeah, omayya_atout: enough stream. paris_vega: right, because it would be a rare situation unless some maybe celebrity paid you guys to make a song and they put it on their social profile and I got a million down loads or something crazy like that. omayya_atout: Yeah, if that, in that case, they still own the copyrights of the song so they can register it themselves and paris_vega: Yeah, omayya_atout: and get paid. You know how they want to, paris_vega: Have you noticed anything similar to that? Where may be like a notable person used the service and you saw it get some social attention or something? omayya_atout: Um, a couple, a couple. Yeah, we've paris_vega: Okay? omayya_atout: early on we had someone from my nine d fiance paris_vega: Oh, omayya_atout: were paris_vega: okay, omayya_atout: seen that show. paris_vega: I think so. yeah, omayya_atout: Yeah, so it was. actually, I don't know nothing about ninety day fiance or sixty day fiance, whatever it's called, But paris_vega: Right. omayya_atout: he made. he had a song made announcing his his baby. He was having another baby with paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: the ninety day fiance woman that he married, paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: and and I didn't think it was a big deal at all, But then he posted it and it got thousands upon thousands. and there was articles written about it About how he announced he's having a baby Was like a big deal. paris_vega: So that just creates more omayya_atout: So paris_vega: exposure omayya_atout: yeah, paris_vega: and people checking it out. omayya_atout: yeah, exactly, let me. I think my headphones are dying. Let me paris_vega: Okay, omayya_atout: try to switch paris_vega: yeah, omayya_atout: this over. paris_vega: Okay, I can hear you There he is. M. maybe we can give in a second. Now we're going to echo. Let's see mute your mike for just a minute. All right, Um, we covered a good bit of stuff, so maybe this is a good place to end it. Um, so that gives us a chance to figure out some technical issues. Uh, but mea, just want to say thank you for being on the show has been incredible story, and definitely want to stay in touch and learn more about how you guys are doing and how you guys grow from here And you can unmute and respond as you feel too. Yep, No, it was good man, All right, thanks.